In principle I could even see myself supporting Mozilla's advertising thing.
It would not be a bad idea, in general, to have a privacy-preserving, ethical advertising network. It would serve as an alternative for vendors, and as an example to regulators that this is possible – and that banning targeted advertising can be done without hurting organizations that rely on ads to stay afloat.
Problem is, I don't trust Mozilla to hold up their side of this.
I used to, but not anymore.
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Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Mozilla has been experiencing a trust problem for years, and should have done some real soul-searching and focusing on regaining that trust – which would allow it to dive into projects like the ad network thing with community support.
Instead, they keep doing things that either seem irrelevant, or outright alienate their core audience. Logo redesign. AI. Now the ads thing.
Or, well, what used to be their core audience:
neilzone.co.uk/2024/09/am-i-st…
Am I (still?) in Mozilla's target audience?
neilzone.co.ukMichał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •At some point they will hit a Trust Thermocline, if they haven't already:
every.to/p/breaching-the-trust…
This is a great moment for someone to come in and offer what Mozilla's the soon-to-be-former core audience is looking for.
And that core audience will then promote it among their friends and family, on their campuses, and in their workplaces.
Exactly the same way Firefox was being promoted, very successfully, when the Web was young.
Breaching the Trust Thermocline Is the Biggest Hidden Risk in Business
every.toMichał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Anyway...
Firefox users: can we have the RSS button back please?
Mozilla: no, nobody wants that.
Also Mozilla: hey we're building an ad network!
Davida Taylor
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •For a fist full of 'bit coins'.
Draken BlackKnight
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Draken BlackKnight • • •@drakenblackknight yeah, it might be a decent stop-gap solution.
Long term we need a fully independent fork or a completely new browser.
Draken BlackKnight
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Dynom
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Ads keep the internet cheap and available for every income.
The problem is less with ads, for me, but more with the profiling and tracking of user data. If we can have an advertisement platform that actually respects user privacy and avoids tracking, the internet can become a slightly better place again.
Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Dynom • • •Dynom
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •if possible yes. But contextual isn't always possible. And then the options are currently limited (Google practically owns the place). Having options next to Google is not a bad thing.
When running without targetable context (e.g. timelines or so) ad space needs to be sold for far cheaper and far fewer advertisers are interested in renting in the first place. This limits ad quality and revenue, so even more ads need to be shown to make it worth renting it out in the first place.
Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Dynom • • •Dynom
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Voline
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •I’m currently following the @servo project and matching to see what happens. Would be poetic if the thing that displaces Firefox was an abandoned Mozilla project.
Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Voline • • •@Voline totally. There is a browser project based on Servo, Verso:
github.com/versotile-org/verso
@mwl @servo
GitHub - versotile-org/verso: A web browser that plays old world blues to build new world hope
GitHubFediThing 🏳️🌈
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Hans van Zijst
in reply to FediThing 🏳️🌈 • • •@FediThing 🏳️🌈 Holy crap, the Mozilla CEO takes 7 million per year?? 😮
I've used it since before it was named Netscape Navigator, but I think it's time to evaluate a few alternatives now...
Lapo Luchini
in reply to Hans van Zijst • •FediThing 🏳️🌈
in reply to Lapo Luchini • • •cerement
in reply to FediThing 🏳️🌈 • • •Lapo Luchini likes this.
Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to cerement • • •JollyOrc
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •I actually worked on a privacy-preserving ethical private-data-using thing for a few years - and it could've been beautiful, alas, funding.
but the core idea (store everything locally, give the end users fine-grained control over what processes can access which data how, process everything locally-only) still is valid and is now a nice little project to see whether one could (with consent!) locally capture and evaluate KDE user metrics for UX improvements.
Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to JollyOrc • • •@jollyorc yeah, I'm with you, this is work that is worth doing and figuring out.
But it requires people to trust whoever is doing it and handling their data, and Mozilla has proven itself untrustworthy.
Also, as far as online ads are concerned, there's quite some data on how contextual ads might be better for advertisers, better for organizations living off of ads, and obviously better for privacy. But I assume you already knew that.
JollyOrc
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •to be honest, I think that advertising as the predominant business model for websites needs to die, it is the original sin of the Internet, setting all the wrong incentives.
sure, there'll always be some ads, but they shouldn't be the main source of income for websites and services.
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Matmar Space
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Matmar Space • • •blog.mozilla.org/en/mozilla/di…
blog.mozilla.org/en/mozilla/im…
blog.mozilla.org/netpolicy/202…
Privacy-Preserving Attribution: Testing for a New Era of Privacy in Digital Advertising - Open Policy & Advocacy
Udbhav Tiwari (Open Policy & Advocacy)Matmar Space
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •Dynom
Unknown parent • • •Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Dynom • • •@dynom again, seems to me you are completely ignoring the context.
And the context is: Mozilla used to be seen as trustworthy, ethical entity in the space. By and large it no longer is seen this way. Partially because it is seen as selling out.
But I am starting to suspect you ignore this context on purpose.
@BassRck5000
Dynom
in reply to Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦 • • •@BassRck5000 I'm not ignoring it, I just think that i prefer a lesser evil over more ones who've lost their moral compas decades ago.
Not agreeing with you, doesn't make me ignorant. It just means I evaluate it differently.
Michał "rysiek" Woźniak · 🇺🇦
in reply to Dynom • • •@dynom @BassRck5000 it's not about agreeing or not, it's about throwing around clichés like "running a profit is not a bad thing".
And I did not call you ignorant. I said you seem to be ignoring the context. That's a different thing, please don't twist my words like that.